I am running 2.0-beta.7.3 and just noticed that when I can no longer tap the option key to change the selection into a column selection. The cursor changes to a crosshairs, so I know that Textmate is seeing the keypress.
I can hold the option key down and drag to get a column selection. But tapping does not toggle the selection type.
Anyone else notice this?
On 18 Jun 2015, at 17:11, Curt Sellmer wrote:
I am running 2.0-beta.7.3 and just noticed that when I can no longer tap the option key to change the selection into a column selection. The cursor changes to a crosshairs, so I know that Textmate is seeing the keypress.
The code to detect a “tap” was changed in beta 7.3 (to also watch for shift), but everything works as expected for me.
Can you make a selection with the mouse and then do a quick tap of the option key. Is that a no-op (apart from briefly changing mouse cursor)?
Are you using an Apple keyboard?
On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 10:25 AM, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
The code to detect a “tap” was changed in beta 7.3 (to also watch for shift), but everything works as expected for me.
Can you make a selection with the mouse and then do a quick tap of the option key. Is that a no-op (apart from briefly changing mouse cursor)?
Are you using an Apple keyboard?
I am using a Logitech keyboard. Does not matter if selection was created with mouse or keyboard. Tapping option is a no-op.
I just tried it on the laptop keyboard (same Mac) and it works fine. This has always worked with the Logitech keyboard in the past.
Curt
On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 10:39 AM, Curt Sellmer sellmerfud@gmail.com wrote:
Are you using an Apple keyboard?
I also noticed that double tapping the shift key on the Logitech keyboard does not consolidate multiple cursors. This works on the Apple keyboard. However, in the first version where you introduced double tapping the shift key, I tried and and it did indeed work on the Logitech keyboard.
On 18 Jun 2015, at 18:04, Curt Sellmer wrote:
I also noticed that double tapping the shift key on the Logitech keyboard does not consolidate multiple cursors. This works on the Apple keyboard. However, in the first version where you introduced double tapping the shift key, I tried and and it did indeed work on the Logitech keyboard.
Can you try (un)plug the keyboard/reboot etc. just to ensure this isn’t a (driver) fluke?
There have been issues in the past where e.g. some “numlock” flag or similar gets set for the third party keyboard, causing some key sequences to be interpreted incorrectly.
On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 12:03 PM, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
Can you try (un)plug the keyboard/reboot etc. just to ensure this isn’t a (driver) fluke?
I just shutdown and restarted. The keyboard is wireless (bluetooth), I also turned it off while rebooting the mac. Same result. The option and shift keys are working on the keyboard for all other uses.
If I tap the option key while there is a selection, I see the cursor briefly change to crosshairs, so Textmate is getting the keyboard event.
On 18 Jun 2015, at 19:15, Curt Sellmer wrote:
I just shutdown and restarted. The keyboard is wireless (bluetooth), I also turned it off while rebooting the mac. Same result. The option and shift keys are working on the keyboard for all other uses.
Can you try update to beta 7.4 (by holding option and clicking “Check Now”) and see if that solves it?
On Thu, Jun 18, 2015 at 12:27 PM, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
Can you try update to beta 7.4 (by holding option and clicking “Check Now”) and see if that solves it?
Yes, with beta 7.4 tapping the option key works to toggle selection and double tapping the shift key works to consolidate multiple cursors.
Thanks for the quick response!
On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:04 AM, Curt Sellmer sellmerfud@gmail.com wrote:
double tapping the shift key on the Logitech keyboard does not consolidate multiple cursors
Didn't know about this feature. This could get tricky because tapping Shift or Option multiple times on Mac already has a meaning. 5 Shift presses toggles Sticky Keys and 5 Option presses toggles Mouse Keys. m.
-- matt neuburg, phd = http://www.apeth.net/matt/ pantes anthropoi tou eidenai oregontai phusei Programming iOS 8! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034261.do iOS 8 Fundamentals! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034278.do RubyFrontier! http://www.apeth.com/RubyFrontierDocs/default.html
On 18 Jun 2015, at 19:39, Matt Neuburg matt@tidbits.com wrote:
On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:04 AM, Curt Sellmer sellmerfud@gmail.com wrote:
double tapping the shift key on the Logitech keyboard does not consolidate multiple cursors
Didn't know about this feature. This could get tricky because tapping Shift or Option multiple times on Mac already has a meaning. 5 Shift presses toggles Sticky Keys and 5 Option presses toggles Mouse Keys. m.
It's been a feature since TM 1, if it hasn't bugged you yet it ain't gonna start now! :)
I couldn't get by without column select, I'd have to learn sed, cut, grep and probably a whole host of other things.
On Jun 19, 2015, at 12:42 AM, Justin Catterall justin@masonsmusic.co.uk wrote:
On 18 Jun 2015, at 19:39, Matt Neuburg matt@tidbits.com wrote:
On Jun 18, 2015, at 9:04 AM, Curt Sellmer sellmerfud@gmail.com wrote:
double tapping the shift key on the Logitech keyboard does not consolidate multiple cursors
Didn't know about this feature. This could get tricky because tapping Shift or Option multiple times on Mac already has a meaning. 5 Shift presses toggles Sticky Keys and 5 Option presses toggles Mouse Keys. m.
It's been a feature since TM 1, if it hasn't bugged you yet it ain't gonna start now! :)
I couldn't get by without column select
Nor could I, but I do it by Option-dragging. What I'm talking about is double-tap-the-Option-key to convert a normal selection into a column select.
I'm not saying this is bad; I'm just saying watch out (or warn users to watch out), because playing with this feature can cause a system-level feature to kick in. m.
-- matt neuburg, phd = http://www.apeth.net/matt/ pantes anthropoi tou eidenai oregontai phusei Programming iOS 8! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034261.do iOS 8 Fundamentals! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034278.do RubyFrontier! http://www.apeth.com/RubyFrontierDocs/default.html
On 19 06 2015, at 17:18, Matt Neuburg matt@tidbits.com wrote:
Nor could I, but I do it by Option-dragging. What I'm talking about is double-tap-the-Option-key to convert a normal selection into a column select.
Actually it’s single tap ⌥ that toggles column select.
I'm not saying this is bad; I'm just saying watch out (or warn users to watch out), because playing with this feature can cause a system-level feature to kick in. m.
Aren’t those universal access features turned off by default? The one who uses them surely knows what he's doing.
On 19 Jun 2015, at 16:18, Matt Neuburg wrote:
Nor could I, but I do it by Option-dragging. What I'm talking about is double-tap-the-Option-key to convert a normal selection into a column select.
I'm not saying this is bad; I'm just saying watch out (or warn users to watch out), because playing with this feature can cause a system-level feature to kick in. m.
I wasn’t aware about the system shortcuts so I appreciate the information.
The option key is unlikely going to clash (it’s btw just a single tap), even for people who have the accessibility feature enabled.
The shift thing could in theory clash, in that someone with the feature enabled, using TextMate’s double-tap shift to deselect last (as well), and wanting to quickly deselect the last 3 selections made, which would be 6 consecutive taps of shift, which would then toggle sticky keys.
In practice though, it seems that TextMate’s use of shift clashes with Launchbar, which I am told defaults to use double-tapping shift as it’s activation key.
I haven’t yet decided what should be done about this.
On Jun 22, 2015, at 5:24 AM, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
On 19 Jun 2015, at 16:18, Matt Neuburg wrote:
Nor could I, but I do it by Option-dragging. What I'm talking about is double-tap-the-Option-key to convert a normal selection into a column select.
I'm not saying this is bad; I'm just saying watch out (or warn users to watch out), because playing with this feature can cause a system-level feature to kick in. m.
I wasn’t aware about the system shortcuts so I appreciate the information.
The option key is unlikely going to clash (it’s btw just a single tap), even for people who have the accessibility feature enabled.
The shift thing could in theory clash, in that someone with the feature enabled, using TextMate’s double-tap shift to deselect last (as well), and wanting to quickly deselect the last 3 selections made, which would be 6 consecutive taps of shift, which would then toggle sticky keys.
In practice though, it seems that TextMate’s use of shift clashes with Launchbar, which I am told defaults to use double-tapping shift as it’s activation key.
I haven’t yet decided what should be done about this.
I don't know that it's the default. The default is Command-Space, as far as I know. But double-tapping shift is a permitted shortcut. I don't know whether anyone actually uses it! I'd say the situation here is the same as with sticky keys; you probably just need to make sure the user is warned that there can be conflict. m.
-- matt neuburg, phd = http://www.apeth.net/matt/ pantes anthropoi tou eidenai oregontai phusei Programming iOS 8! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034261.do iOS 8 Fundamentals! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034278.do RubyFrontier! http://www.apeth.com/RubyFrontierDocs/default.html
On 22 Jun 2015, at 14:24, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
I haven’t yet decided what should be done about this.
IMHO, double-tap modifiers are rare and should be kept for system wide shortcuts.
I use: 2 x cmd for LaunchBar activation 2 x opt for LaunchBar Instant Send 2 x fn to activate iTerm 2 x ctrl to open a Finder's window 2 x shift to activate TextMate
Fortunately for me, I use double shift for TM so I can deactivate it when TM is at the front, but I still think that if you want to use double-tap modifiers, you should provide a way to deactivate it and use a normal shortcut instead.
That's sort of the notion I've been hinting at too. I don't quite see why there can't be a normal keyboard shortcut with the meaning(s) involved here. m.
On Jun 22, 2015, at 5:24 AM, Allan Odgaard mailinglist@textmate.org wrote:
On 19 Jun 2015, at 16:18, Matt Neuburg wrote:
Nor could I, but I do it by Option-dragging. What I'm talking about is double-tap-the-Option-key to convert a normal selection into a column select.
I'm not saying this is bad; I'm just saying watch out (or warn users to watch out), because playing with this feature can cause a system-level feature to kick in. m.
I wasn’t aware about the system shortcuts so I appreciate the information.
The option key is unlikely going to clash (it’s btw just a single tap), even for people who have the accessibility feature enabled.
The shift thing could in theory clash, in that someone with the feature enabled, using TextMate’s double-tap shift to deselect last (as well), and wanting to quickly deselect the last 3 selections made, which would be 6 consecutive taps of shift, which would then toggle sticky keys.
In practice though, it seems that TextMate’s use of shift clashes with Launchbar, which I am told defaults to use double-tapping shift as it’s activation key.
I haven’t yet decided what should be done about this.
textmate mailing list textmate@lists.macromates.com http://lists.macromates.com/listinfo/textmate
-- matt neuburg, phd = http://www.apeth.net/matt/ pantes anthropoi tou eidenai oregontai phusei Programming iOS 8! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034261.do iOS 8 Fundamentals! http://shop.oreilly.com/product/0636920034278.do RubyFrontier! http://www.apeth.com/RubyFrontierDocs/default.html
On 25 Jun 2015, at 20:01, Matt Neuburg wrote:
That's sort of the notion I've been hinting at too. I don't quite see why there can't be a normal keyboard shortcut with the meaning(s) involved here. m.
The functionality can be bound to another key, see https://github.com/textmate/textmate/commit/980b0b9796b828539f3a4956aa16fd10...
The reason I picked double-shift here is that we are in the selection realm. We select with shift and arrow keys, we use option to change the selection type (columnar), so it didn’t seem too far fetched to then use double-shift to deselect, as it’s somewhat symmetric with shift for selecting (and we’re more or less out of regular key shortcuts).
But I am sympathetic to the arguments raised in this thread.
Binding actions to single/double-tap of modifiers is however not code that is currently suitable for being parameterised (user configurable).
So for now I think double-shift should remain the default (hardcoded). The chance of clashing should be low, since double-shift in TextMate only has meaning when there are multiple carets/discontinous selections (or a freehanded caret). The most likely issue is that a global action will eclipse TextMate, in which case the user will have to manually bind the action to another key, if they need the feature.
But down the road, binding actions to modifiers could maybe be exposed to the user, or, if anyone has an unsolvable clash with the current hardcoding, I can add a setting to disable double-shift.
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Allan Odgaard -
Curt Sellmer -
Fred ALB -
Igor K -
Justin Catterall -
Matt Neuburg